Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

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PiF
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby PiF » Fri Mar 25, 2016 1:10 am

AVEN....When I first joined in 2007/2008 it was a smaller community but it had more of an integrity about it...it was genuinely an asexual community that welcomed all

Now it is a ...Aboromantic Androromantic Aromantic Biromantic Gyneromantic Heteroromantic Homoromantic Panromantic Polyromantic
Proquuromantic (is there a fem version of this?) Sapioromantic (not actually sure where this one goes) Transromantic Acoromantic Adfecturomantic / Affecturomantic / Adfectual / Adforomantic Alloromantic / Zedromantic Alterous Apathromantic Apothiromantic Apresromantic Aroflux Arovague Autochorisromantic/Aegoromantic Bellusromantic Borearomantic Burstromantic Caedromantic Cupioromantic Demiromantic Frayromantic Grayromantic Hyporomantic Idemromantic Lithromantic / Aporomantic / Akoi(ne)romantic Nebularomantic Noviromantic Omniromantic Placioromantic Post rubor Quasiromantic Quoiromantic Recipromantic Requi(es)romantic Schromantic semisexual Amatonormitivity Aromate Lush Nonamory Peach Fuzz Plush Soft Romo Smuch Swish Squish Queerplatonic.....community that happens to have asexuality in the title and is rapidly moving away from welcoming all

Wait a minute PiF that's a contradiction...how can it be moving away from all and then you list what some see as the current types of asexuality in aven ?

Well..despite some so desperate to wear an asexual badge..pretty much all of those above are sexual terms that have nothing to do with asexuality at all...and when it's pointed out not only are they sexual terms, have nothing to do with asexuality, but most importantly corrupting and confusing the asexual projection message both inside and outside of the asexual way of life...they then seek to remove more and more people seeing that damage it by placing up walls

Aven used to be avaliable to all..now it is only avaliable if you join. Has aven become so bad that it now accepts more sexual terms and groups so that it isolates those for whom the very reason it was created..to provide a place for asexuals? . Now if people come looking ..often afraid to join..but wishing to look, research and see the community......the very same people who had that freedom before for themselves ..are taking it away from others ...forever

Tans right..aven used to be asexual inclusive and a sexual welcoming place...now it's become ..if your names not on the list, you're not coming in

how is that progress in trying to show people who and what we are?..since when did it turn into a social clique that we think every thing we say and do must be so important that it must be hidden?

at a time when we say we want more visibility for asexuality.... at what point did we become so unwelcoming that we thought ourselves so elite that no one could see what we as asexuals are?

Aven has turned inwards, closing doors whilst becoming a very backward looking sexual forum for the few..it was created to be more open not to be more closed

This is not what aven was created for ..it isn't what we should allow it to become.

Thrasymachus
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Fri Mar 25, 2016 9:07 am

Well the psychologically disturbed weirdos and cowards who have run AVEN into the ground have temporarily suspended me for being the foremost voice attesting to what a shithole AVEN is.

Do they actually think they are punishing people by suspending or banning? Like I had told you AVEN nerds so many times, you simply cannot attract well adjusted people who have something better to do in real life. Instead you have whiners, people who are way too processed by the mental health industry and seek to create the same type of over-classification for sexuality/asexuality, overall losers, people who whine they don't need social interaction yet still for some reason makes thousands of online posts due to loneliness that they allegedly don't feel, etc. When you suspend people/ban them you do them a favor, because they are forced to spend their time not interacting with AVEN's mentally damaged, whiny, special cupcake userbase.

Idiots who run AVEN today:
You are not even competent to run a cat-macro and image posting forum, let alone a forum full of psychologically confused, mentally confused and sexually confused people like AVEN. What you are doing is so wrong. I have been on well run forums and a married man, with a full-time job who is the sole mod on the best run forum I post on, actually takes the time to warn users of offending posts and tell them to reword it. Which you compare to AVEN which has hordes of admins/mods and posts disappear for no reason, with no explanation and sometimes you get a vague justification based on the rules, but AVEN is a "who are you", not "what you do" forum, so the rules are just used a justifications against those who are not liked. You clowns need to get over your unearned superiority complex, turning asexuality into a joke is not an achievement. That is all your achieving for "volunteering" at the AVEN shithole.

PiF
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby PiF » Mon Mar 28, 2016 4:23 am

♥ Steph ♥ wrote:
PiF wrote:the 2015 census..still nowhere to be seen despite it closing on december 11th 2015. If they were hoping to post it AFTER they ring fenced aven from the general public, they haven't thought that through too well as it will be published in other places as it was not just an aven specific..although it was an aven led census.


No. This is now PT territory regarding the census. We're having our own difficulties regarding the census that are not related to how the forums are being run/ changed. Yes, we understand we're delayed. No, there is no hidden agenda. We made a boo-boo trying to use a different way of analyzing the data and its set us back. Additionally the census, once published, will be fully advertised on social media and the front page.

PiF, you know I won't let you slander the PT as shady while I'm on the Team :lol:


I've had a bit more time to think on this . The census was run, loads of people took time to input..from what your saying steph is that someone took the raw data, fed it into an untried system and no one thought to back up the info before doing this?

If the info had been backed up then it would be simple to just enter it using the old system and would have been released by now. is that the case?

It wouldn't take 4 months to correct this...Funnily enough i myself ran some polls in aven and broke them down into percentages that people felt asexual and again into age groups....both polls were locked by the team saying it may interfere with the 2014 census

using a cynical approach :D I still have some massive doubts/reservations about the 2015 census even seeing daylight and given the results of the 2014 census...I can understand why there is some concern

♥ Steph ♥
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Mon Mar 28, 2016 5:37 am

PiF wrote:
♥ Steph ♥ wrote:
PiF wrote:the 2015 census..still nowhere to be seen despite it closing on december 11th 2015. If they were hoping to post it AFTER they ring fenced aven from the general public, they haven't thought that through too well as it will be published in other places as it was not just an aven specific..although it was an aven led census.


No. This is now PT territory regarding the census. We're having our own difficulties regarding the census that are not related to how the forums are being run/ changed. Yes, we understand we're delayed. No, there is no hidden agenda. We made a boo-boo trying to use a different way of analyzing the data and its set us back. Additionally the census, once published, will be fully advertised on social media and the front page.

PiF, you know I won't let you slander the PT as shady while I'm on the Team :lol:


I've had a bit more time to think on this . The census was run, loads of people took time to input..from what your saying steph is that someone took the raw data, fed it into an untried system and no one thought to back up the info before doing this?

If the info had been backed up then it would be simple to just enter it using the old system and would have been released by now. is that the case

It wouldn't take 4 months to correct this...Funnily enough i myself ran some polls in aven and broke them down into percentages that people felt asexual and again into age groups....both polls were locked by the team saying it may interfere with the 2014 census

using a cynical approach :D I still have some massive doubts/reservations about the 2015 census even seeing daylight and given the results of the 2014 census...I can understand why there is some concern



You're more or less correct. We still have the raw data (last I checked). The issue relies on this new program and I honestly don't have all the details myself. That and human nature have caused the delays.

PiF
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby PiF » Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:39 am

Thanks for that Steph....I still suspect it won't be released and probably some conversations in dark corners if they should continue at all, seeing as the census supports in figures, the stereotype of an "asexual" is actually true for the majority.

I see the donald trump poll has closed http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/1358 ... mber-only/

putting up walls to protect the community from undesirables is trumpism in its purest form...it surprised me some of the for comments such as

I also like it because this means that those thread details aren't being indexed by, say, the Way Back Machine or showing up on Google.

OhMG I just googled "sally asexual" and got a post I'd made in Asexual Democrats on AVEN

I think the google indexing is what is the biggest issue for me- even if a lot of strangers can still see my posts through being an AVEN member,

Let me point out something ..taken within the last 15 minutes from the first line of the members list at the bottom of the main page

275 users are online (in the past 15 minutes)
75 members, 186 guests, 14 anonymous users

Kyon., Kelly, Tystie, Google, Yahoo, Bing, flesh-pocket, Homer S., 2tabbymom, Syrotik, aunt b, NewWeeble, Zenom, desertbat, Niliinvas, goldensun, emma-can, timewarp, ThaHoward, iff, LaerBear,

when people have mentioned google indexing....google...yahoo...bing and quite a few other search engines [b]are all members[/b]....So say If I was looking for what my child was upto online, all I have to do is join as a member and google, yahoo, bing etc will still help me track them as the search engines save EVERYTHING they have ever said in aven...EVERYTHING

I forecast within a very short time aven will be completely donald trumped with walls springing up all around it..but when the snowflakes wake up and realise all of the search engines are members too...then they will have some members asking for the search engines to be banned...under the last campaign of "members privacy and security is paramount", the admods can't refuse it...the terms grave..dug..own .....come to mind.

Also are the admods bypassing their own rules?

Declass was done so it could be a system of accountability(the only one members have for the backroom)..the admods refused to do this so a declass team was asked for, pushed for and is now in existance

but it appears that more and more admins and mods are using the admods skype group to bypass much of the official discussions that should show up through declass....look at the declasses from 5 or 6 years ago..pretty much almost all admods had an input...then it dropped to simply saying for most.."just voted"....recent ones have shown very few debating events relevant to these discussions or even declaring they had voted ..so where have all the discussions gone? how are they making decisions with some making no inputs?

simply put...the off aven skype admod group is now being used in a way the mod forum should be ..and used to bypass due process..so if it carries on..all the declass team will be declassing, is the vote figure and nothing else

I'm always weary when those elected in, openly seek to deliberately hiddenm, secrete away and lose what should be public.

Skycaptain
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Skycaptain » Wed Mar 30, 2016 11:46 am

Thrasymachus wrote:Well the psychologically disturbed weirdos and cowards who have run AVEN into the ground have temporarily suspended me for being the foremost voice attesting to what a shithole AVEN is.

Do they actually think they are punishing people by suspending or banning? Like I had told you AVEN nerds so many times, you simply cannot attract well adjusted people who have something better to do in real life. Instead you have whiners, people who are way too processed by the mental health industry and seek to create the same type of over-classification for sexuality/asexuality, overall losers, people who whine they don't need social interaction yet still for some reason makes thousands of online posts due to loneliness that they allegedly don't feel, etc. When you suspend people/ban them you do them a favor, because they are forced to spend their time not interacting with AVEN's mentally damaged, whiny, special cupcake userbase.

Idiots who run AVEN today:
You are not even competent to run a cat-macro and image posting forum, let alone a forum full of psychologically confused, mentally confused and sexually confused people like AVEN. What you are doing is so wrong. I have been on well run forums and a married man, with a full-time job who is the sole mod on the best run forum I post on, actually takes the time to warn users of offending posts and tell them to reword it. Which you compare to AVEN which has hordes of admins/mods and posts disappear for no reason, with no explanation and sometimes you get a vague justification based on the rules, but AVEN is a "who are you", not "what you do" forum, so the rules are just used a justifications against those who are not liked. You clowns need to get over your unearned superiority complex, turning asexuality into a joke is not an achievement. That is all your achieving for "volunteering" at the AVEN shithole.

you wish to have that opinion fine. I disagree

Vivaldi Ives
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Vivaldi Ives » Wed Mar 30, 2016 2:07 pm

Given that Thrasymachus does not appear to be a long-term AVEN member, I wonder why on earth he feels the need to bash the site and its users...

Thrasymachus
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Wed Mar 30, 2016 11:25 pm

@Skycaptain:
Let's cut the shit, shall we? You like most the other Aven mods/admins are horrible at modding in terms of creating a quality atmosphere. Actually on purpose you and the rest of the mods are trying to create a low-quality atmosphere where only people interested in surrogate online socialization will bother, because I cannot find a single admin/mod that seems to have less than 10,000 posts.

On toxic forums like AVEN the stated rules have nothing to do with what is actually enforced. AVEN as it stands now is just for people with little to no outside social life to live a substitute life online. That is why so many posters have 5,000+ posts, 10,000+ posts, alot of people there have even 25,000+ posts! Come on it is obvious what is going on and alot of those no life posters are not even asexuals. I have been pointing this out so you crappy mods are finding pretexts to ban me, while you allow drama queens(when I pointed out that since AVEN has so many sexuals that they really should be made to identify themselves, one little prat starting whining about Nazis and genocide), people with nothing better to do than argue/troll, precious snowflakes, whiners, know it all teens/early 20 somethings. Those groups are the real threats to quality discussion -- which AVEN(as it is just a lonely hearts club), is not interested in.

Well congrats geniuses all you will achieve is make AVEN more of a joke by continuing to allow toxic, no life people to dominate and most people with life experience that consists of anything more than consuming too much popular music, movies and tv shows will figure out what AVEN actually is, that quality discussion is not possible there, and not bother sticking around way before they get to 100 posts. Since I am very vocal about why AVEN sucks so hard, you, the rest of the mods and the whiny, entrenched unrealistic 5000+ post club who are likely constantly reporting me, all are finding flimsy pretexts to ban me, so you can continue turning AVEN into a forum for very lonely, desperate people who may or may not be asexual.

If anyone thinks I am making this up. Cue the clown music in your head: "duh, duh, duh, duh, duh":
AVEN Thread: How high can we count?
What is that thread? Everyone just seems to post a number and tries to see how high they can count sequentially as group, but someone can post 1 and restart the count. Do people with lives bother with that nonsense? Never. Look how many mods post to that thread, btw. It is literally something only people who look at forums as mainly something to distract themselves from their life would do. That is how the high post queens/kings of AVEN get to 10,000+ posts, it is not by mature discussion.

@Vivaldi Ives:
I bash AVEN because it has to be the most toxic, low-quality webforum I have ever had the misfortune of registering to. And the nutters who run the site make such bombastic claims it is only laughable. I found the forum via the documentary Asexual(2011) and David Jay claimed that there was little done to research, educate about or discuss asexuality so he started this forum. Is AVEN place just a forum(and a low quality discussion forum at that)? Or is this some magical place where everyone makes friends, finds their mates via online surrogate socialization and then a long-distance relationship(great for those with little options), where people act like the DSM committee of sexuality and asexuality, educating people about useless asexuality terms invented here that the rest of the world has no interest in, for lonely people to constantly make low effort posts online to not feel so alone, a substitute for social science research? AVEN tries to have its hands in every basket and thus fails to net any basket. To get good at something you need to focus and pick something, trying everything results only at failing at everything.

Can you point me to any quality AVEN thread, full of a realistic, mature discussion? You cannot because realistic, mature people stay clear of AVEN. When a forum is dominated by people who have nothing better than to post 10,000+ posts on a low-quality webforum, that is not a healthy forum. First, to have something worthy to say you would have to spend time reading serious non-fiction, contemplating, accumulating life experiences -- basically everything the no life internet addicts have no intention of doing. The life experiences of the AVEN thousand+ post club who dominate and steer most discussions, begin and end with spending way too much time online.
Last edited by Thrasymachus on Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

PiF
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby PiF » Thu Mar 31, 2016 2:02 am

If I may join in?

There are some mods I like, there are some I dislike with good reason but generally when I vent my displeasure at them, I do so knowing most of the continual crap decisions and actions they make are done by a mod majority vote so generally when I say the backroom I mean as a majority. I do not feel every mod is a bad one although I have seen incredibly good members go into the backroom and change beyond recognition from the nice person they used to be, that has saddened me..but again I view them as a collective and they need to take responsibility as such

I would agree thras that the current joke that aven is, has largely been created by the mods..they ultimately steer the community..members may from time to time try and take a turn at the wheel but as we have seen by recent polls...mods accept the ones that suit them and refuse those which may have a popularist support but the mods disagree with....6 months to 3 months of admod qualifying anyone? they did say they would get back to the members, yeah right :lol:

I don't agree Aven is a toxic forum as forums go, I would agree in regards to asexual promotion and asexual integrity it is probably THE most destructive Asexual toxic forum there is

I've never myself worried about post counts but I do see some of what you are saying . I have always been a prolific poster because I am asexual, very mentally active and can be a bit of a dick from time to time..but there has also been through work...times when I have not had any internet of any kind for weeks or months so my input will have been nil but my post count will not show that.

There are I would agree, some who see asexuality as a gym membership, join quick, post shedloads, try and change the direction of aven, the definition of asexuality, then they leave within months...this is pretty much the continual revolving door of most of avens membership.

Some of those who post in high numbers in aven if you look will have been there years and were probably there at the beginning so they have invested in the asexual community...most as you say though, are just kids bored at uni/college or it's the school holidays but to be fair to aven..that probaly happens on most forums that have a large teen/young adult user base.

You said...I have been pointing this out so you crappy mods are finding pretexts to ban me, while you allow drama queens(when I pointed out that since AVEN has so many sexuals that they really should be made to identify themselves, one little prat starting whining about Nazis and genocide), people with nothing better to do than argue/troll, precious snowflakes, whiners, know it all teens/early 20 somethings. Those groups are the real threats to quality discussion -- which AVEN(as it is just a lonely hearts club), is not interested in.

I get your drift but would have to disagree on some points. My own feelings are are that only about 10% of aven are full time asexuals. About 75% are sexuals pretending/desperate to be asexuals through dubious made up and supersillious labels and the remaining are sexuals who have no issues with being sexual...I don't agree with "making them identify themselves"..and yes I have used the nazi thing myself before when asking about what next? tattooing numbers on them or wearing pink stars of david on their avatar..yes it is stupid but I've used it to highlight the stupidity of the original "branding/identifying" people idea

a forum full of special snowflakes who are in there no longer than 6-12 months who are always pressing the report button on each other..is far easy to control than a forum full of people from the real world, real life experiences and real life real world opinions..I would suspect that those in there the longest are older people and they would have had more nudges,warnings and fall outs with the mods because they tend to speak with real life opinions and experience in a place with very little. Most of these snowflakes have a complete lack of long termism and go mind blank on anything that lasts over a few weeks

The ban thing..hey..I was banned for saying poo poo pants in the hot box :lol: and when you look at those two seperate threads..the first one discussing a different nudge..they agreed I was correct and a nudge should not have been issued and my point was valid but...within weeks they brought in the warning discussion about my poo poo pants comment in the hotbox to get a warn and again brought up the very same issue they had previously agreed..was not an issue only a few weeks earlier..two bites at the same cherry if you will

so yes..they do apply the rules depending on who and not on what...yes they do bend the tos when it suits them and yes...unless you sign up to the special snowflake agender then yes..they will do their best to ban you.....but this isn't new...more and more people are seeing this through declass..why do you think now they do much of the correct to declass decisions..off site in their skype group to avoid members seeing it when declass comes up?..they know as a group they have become a vindictive group..some are okay with it, some are uncomfortable with it but go along with it and those who say anything, tend to leave then get stonewalled..Look how many admods leave there never to be seen again..anywhere in aven and those ex team members who have stood upto the team as a normal member have been villified and had election campaigns sabotaged not once but multiple times

Do they target people? yes....do they apply the rules depending on who rather than what has happened? yes...have they gone looking for members posts in other forums to use against them in aven? yes...do they seek to protect the shambles aven has become for asexuality rather than take some responsibility themselves? yes..are they ever likely to change? unlikely

As a group, they are more Putin than the united nations..is that ever likely to change? No...are there ever going to be enough members in there long enough and old enough to ever make a difference? no..it's on a downward slide and it is taking asexuality with it

are the mods ever likely to restructure aven to make aven attractive to full time asexuals across the whole age range spectrum instead of keeping it as a place for kiddy snowflake faux asexuals...unlikley

Can you point me to any quality AVEN thread, full of a realistic, mature discussion? You cannot because realistic, mature people stay clear of AVEN.

true..there are very few but there are some.... but again you have to look at the census of 2014 and the 15 (if it ever turns up :P ) Online asexuality is mostly kids at school/college/uni..so it makes sense the largest asexual forum is viewed as nothing more than a kiddie phase and that forum would reflect that.....yes it kills the honesty of asexuality and even increases the doubt that we even exist and yes aven is largely responsible for this under the admods.

If you are a teen wanting to claim the asexual badge for a few months even though your not..aven is a great place...if you are a full time asexual across the ages..aven can be the worst place on earth for you as an asexual and for the asexual movement

Can we change it? It's unlikely as most of the asexual movement are not asexual at all so they are highly unlikely to want to give up that badge for honest projection

In regards to aven itself, is it a badly run forum? probably no different than most youth based forums, is it bad for asexuality?..no doubt, are they by doing a trump in putting walls up trying to hide how bad it has become? without a shadow of a doubt they are..even they know how bad it has become but they lack either the ability or want, to bring asexuality back from the precipise of asexuality being seen as nothing more than a teen disease and phase

so on that part I would agree with you that the doubt and lack of integrity about asexuality is to be laid firmly at avens admods feet...sometimes however I remember that old saying..we all get the government we deserve...it's just a shame that aven is taking down those of us who are full time asexuals in favour of sexuals and faux asexuals.

In regards to promoting asexuality...aven has gone from that bright young thing full of hope, integrity and direction...and has morphed into that arrogant , self serving and embarrasing old uncle

The reality is..until avens membership wakes up and does something about it to turn it from snowflake central back into asexual central..then asexuality as a genuine thing..Has a pretty rocky if not very painful road ahead

♥ Steph ♥
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Thu Mar 31, 2016 12:11 pm

Thrasymachus wrote:[snip] When a forum is dominated by people who have nothing better than to post 10,000+ posts on a low-quality webforum, that is not a healthy forum.


You had better be speaking ONLY regarding the forum and not AVEN as an organization. You've already insulted Asexual Research - Let's see how many more times you can push my buttons before I get angry.

Thrasymachus
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 12:44 pm

Steph, I would advise you to not make threats or act big. The only thing you can do besides make asexuality look like a joke (which AVEN is super successful at), is ban people and force them to interact instead more in real life or a higher quality webforums. What research? You just have a low-quality web-forum for lonely people whether asexual or not, to play online word games and rack up ridiculous amounts of post counts and spend massive of time distracting and wasting time online. Anyone well read, familiar with social science research or research in general will certainly not allow the lonely hearts club of AVEN to have power over them or co-operate with AVEN's perverted version of research.

Stop trying to be "The Asexual Visibility and Education Network" because AVEN will never be that. If AVEN disappeared it would be a huge victory for asexuality and its public profile. I have never seen a forum in my whole life make such bombastic claims about itself. It would be one thing if it was a high quality forum, but AVEN is the exact opposite. If I wasted time to conduct "AVEN online research" I could prove most posts there are in lame word game threads and other nonsense written by lonely people trying to pass the time due to a lack of anything better to do. When that is what a forum is about, it seeps into every crack, even the non-word game threads, as the people with time to waste come to dominate and everyone else stops bothering, because they don't have the same time.

AVEN should just let the social science researchers do their thing without AVEN and clear away. And also stop acting like a stupid forum is a nexus of activism or education, also.

♥ Steph ♥
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Thu Mar 31, 2016 1:00 pm

Thrasymachus wrote:Steph, I would advise you to not make threats or act big. The only thing you can do besides make asexuality look like a joke (which AVEN is super successful at), is ban people and force them to interact instead more in real life or a higher quality webforums. What research? You clowns just have a low-quality web-forum for lonely people whether asexual or not, to play online word games and rack up ridiculous amounts of post counts and spend massive of time distracting and wasting time online. Anyone well read, familiar with social science research or research in general will certainly not allow the lonely hearts club of AVEN to have power over them or co-operate with AVEN's perverted version of research.

Stop trying to be "The Asexual Visibility and Education Network" because AVEN will never be that. If AVEN disappeared it would be a huge victory for asexuality and its public profile. I have never seen a forum in my whole life make such bombastic claims about itself. It would be one thing if it was a high quality forum, but AVEN is the exact opposite. If I wasted time to conduct "AVEN online research" I could prove most posts there are in lame word game threads and other nonsense written by lonely people trying to pass the time due to a lack of anything better to do. When that is what a forum is about, it seeps into every crack, even the non-word game threads, as the people with time to waste come to dominate and everyone else stops bothering, because they don't have the same time.

AVEN should just let the social science researchers do their thing without AVEN and clear away. And also stop acting like a stupid forum is a nexus of activism or education, also.
.

Please. If you know anything about me its that I don't act big. I just am. If we're on the topic of Research, I've had the pleasure of test-piloting an MRI Experiment that is happening in both Toronto, Canada and Vancouver, Canada, reviewed and advertised over 45 Global Research Requests in my first term of being the Dedicated Research Contact (Which is only 9 months that's roughly 1.3 a week). I've been on stage at World Pride 2014, currently preparing to host two full (hour long) Panels at World Pride 2017. Spoken at numerous Universities (Currently at 7), plus two LGBTQ+ Conferences. My best friend regulates the social media accounts and has been excellently increasing our social media following since her election this past month (I've seen the stats, we've jumped from 8k daily views to almost 20k daily). With an announcement next week we plan to skyrocket visibility even more!

Therefore; before you bash an organization that is actively working for visibility maybe you should go outside and tell the neighbours dog about asexuality. It would be a hell of a lot more productive cause than bashing visibility efforts on a reclusive corner. You and PiF; while holding similar values, are dramatically different. I actually hold monumental respect for PiF, I have none for you. Therefore feel free to bash the forums, I don't care because its a community. They can be toxic or great. However the moment you cross into insulting the efforts of people trying to make a difference who aren't heavily associated with the forums then you have no right unless you do some yourself.

Pif and Tanwen are amazing examples of good people. You've proven in this Apositive Thread why you were banned from AVEN in under 50 posts. EDIT: Correction - Suspended. I don't read reports I just remember you talking about being banned yesterday. Reread and saw it was suspension. Atleast PiF made it to over 7000 posts before being banned :lol: :lol: :lol:

Also we are not a nexus of activism and education. We are a network. We communicate with others and get the word around. That is why AVEN is the powerhouse it is.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 1:30 pm

The type of visibility AVEN does is counter-productive. Any well adjusted person who sees AVEN will run away from AVEN and what is about:
Steph wrote:My best friend regulates the social media accounts and has been excellently increasing our social media following since her election this past month (I've seen the stats, we've jumped from 8k daily views to almost 20k daily).


I don't think using social media especially twitter, especially to promote batshit AVENisms created by young, un-experienced, naive people is doing much positive. Unless you consider turning non-asexuals sour to asexuality nonsense by dousing them with AVEN and AVENisms, positive? Your best "online" friend, surely? Do you have the stats for the massive amount of page-views or hits the AVEN forum gets? Again most of that is from extremely lonely people and has nothing to do with asexuality in any way. There is a difference between quality and quantity.

I don't think activism for pet sexual preferences is useful. I do feel guilty for not getting involved in anti-consumer or vegan activism that could actually make the world a better place. But who people f*ck or don't f*ck, doesn't make the world a better place. Well within limits, in that the more people living a consumer-capitalist existence that turn gay, transgender, asexual and that create difficulties for themselves to reproduce and have children does sort of the make the world better, by leading to less future consumer capitalists mucking up the world. To me it is irksome how the LGBT communities act superior, more progressive for their pet bedroom preferences. Who you f*ck doesn't effect the world. Maybe who you don't f*ck can in a positive way by leading to less future worker-producers destroying the world for our alienated, technological mode of existence. It never sit well with me the scene with David Jay in the documentary where he attached himself and asexuality to hijack some LGBT parade or whatever. It is like me since I hate clubbing passionately, to go outside of clubs and convince others to hate clubbing. Why would I care to convince others about something I am NOT passionate about? Asexuals are not passionate about sex, so they should not hijack the events of those who are passionate about gay or lesbian sex. Thus I identified more with the lesbians and gays heckling the semi-autistic, asexual activists with David Jay, than the asexuals -- I felt they were more in the right, because the asexuals were actually invaders of sorts. Like I said I probably wasted my time writing this because the people who love and defend AVEN are about as realistic about the world as gamergate nerds are.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Tanwen » Thu Mar 31, 2016 2:08 pm

I've been around AVEN for over 10 years - KAGU even longer neither of us are in the 'first flush of youth'. Yes I get frustrated with the way things are but PiF is right when he says there are some good people in admods, but decisions are made by majority vote.
You lose nothing when fighting for a cause ... In my mind the losers are those who don't have a cause they care about. - Muhammad Ali

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Thu Mar 31, 2016 2:09 pm

To begin my best 'online' friend, I've actually met and she's dating my ex currently so yeah. We're all pretty tight knit together. Secondly, take a look at the Twitter Page. I'd say advertising different article, asexual groups and asexuality related research is much more than 'AVENism'. https://twitter.com/asexuality?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Plus do not play strawman. You talked shit about Research, which is my pride and joy regarding Asexual Activism. Do not twist this argument to make yourself better. Especially while you're failing to provide any evidence for your claims. I could very easily ask for the statistics from the Admins on AVEN if you'd like? I can back that claim up. However I was speaking about the views our social media is getting and how it has increased since Cosine became Media Director. Stay focused on the argument or don't argue at all. Both sources of view statistics I can provide. Plus I made no claim on AVEN's views. You've lost this argument.

As for activism; What have you made your life into? You're a 33 year old painter with minimal educational background arguing blindly about sexuality and activism. Rather than argue without knowing adequate information why not pick up a book on sexualities and then debate the importance that social activism, research and movements have. As for personal opinions; there is a very fine line between being respected for your opinions and imposing those opinions on others. You'd cross that line the moment you try to persuade someone else from going clubbing. That is my own personal motto. Be respected for not engaging in sex, but not forcing others to NOT engage in sex.

Also, insulting my intelligence (As a defender of AVEN's Organizational values and purpose) is an ad hominem. You aren't attacking my argument, just my character which is irrelevant and dismissive to my position. I have no reputation to lose and I am well respected among the Apositive community. Therefore focus on the issues you have with AVEN and not the people. Next time you should learn how to debate before trolling. It would make it seem much less obvious.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 2:39 pm

Increasing social media numbers, especially from AVEN, just means more non-asexuals have washed their hands with asexuality and its nonsense. I personally convinced my uncle who is very pro-marriage and kids, with the arguments used in this thread that marriage/kids is a not a good deal:
The Walnut Theory: Sex, Marriage & Kids Are Not Worth It

He even retreated to "but its not natural", and admitted that most married couples he knew were unhappily married, but still maintained in the end it is something you must do for tradition, posterity, etc. I can convince even most married couples that being a married couple with kids is about a "sacred sacrifice" on behalf of your family, because I am realistic and intellectually curious. Btw when I posted the same thread on AVEN I got heckled by two AVEN neckbeards who met up on a playcation for a month in Canada paid by their parents or whatever and acted like their success story countered the sources cited, and it typical AVEN neckbeard fashion I was ganged up on with their fellow AVEN neckbeard allies who all worked in concert get the thread locked:
http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/1347 ... -worth-it/
http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/1225 ... p-for-two/

Now if I was clueless enough to use and explain AVENisms created mostly stunted geeks to my uncle who doesn't even know English, I would never have to got my uncle to admit that my lifestyle, not really seeking a female partner, no desire to marry or have kids really has its merits.

I am not a painter, snotty, social prestige and money seeking person. But I was a house painter for a while in my twenties and was the in the houses of many university educated professionals and saw just how intellectually incurious they were again and again by looking at the spines of their bookshelves. A good work on this is Disciplined Minds: A Critical Look at Salaried Professionals and the Soul-battering System That Shapes Their Lives by Jeff Schmidt (2000):
http://www.unwelcomeguests.net/Disciplined_Minds

The more educated people tend to have more social power in their jobs, but are the least likely to use it in a way that could hurt the dominant ideology and elites. Schmidt shows that educated professionals consider themselves more liberal because they may against things like racism, sexual bigotry, war, etc. in theory. But they don't exercise political power, the biggest social power they exercise is through their jobs and in their jobs they are very conservative. So in actuality the more educated you are the more conservative you tend to be. For example recently I went to the Science and Technology Museum in Technology in Thessaloniki, Greece and they had a green exhibit that said humanity only had about 40 years of oil based energy given current known reserves and usage. Which means all our infrastructure and entire way of life would have to transform starting now, because you cannot change national or global infrastructure overnight, you have to do it over decades. However there is no talk of this task facing humanity, because everyone is too distracted, busy entertaining themselves, obedient and in Western nations too well rewarded with trinkets. However according to your neckbeard self, we should be ashamed were not into asexuality education or LGBT activism....

Which is probably why you think useless activism on pet sexual preferences is making the world a better place or something, when it is not. It is the characteristic of over-educated liberals. They ignore how they exercise social power in their job sphere, always for the dominant social order, but try to guilt the general public for not being LGBT sensitive. As if the ignoring their service to social power, and instead focusing on their alleged liberal views on bedroom practices is a benefit to humanity. It is not, who others f*ck is not my business as long as they don't have kids or raise responsible ones(which under consumer capitalism they cannot because you are not an island to yourself and thus the average person cannot raise a kid with good values, since outside social forces like television, advertising, other adults, other children, schooling will insure they are brats indoctrinated into the selfish ideologies created by economists and other dominant social ideologues).

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:03 pm

Excellent retort! I'm proud of you :D Well done. You accurately supported your claims quite dashingly. It still contains hints of the strawman fallacy and is twisting my position making it easier to attack but otherwise you're excellently debating the topic.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:16 pm

Don't patronize me. But thanks for indirectly helping proving that AVEN is a neckbeard forum, for neckbeards and by neckbeards that can only socialize with someone in real life after wasting alot of time online with them. It is a popular social trope that neckbeards are sexually alienated and clueless, so it is no surprise that most would convince themselves that they are asexual or born that way. In reality if they stopped being socially awkward neckbeards they could probably be sexually rehabilitated.

I also have cited this hilarious video in the past from AVEN and its outreach no doubt:
https://youtu.be/yrXWqwuOqIQ?t=328

Interviewer Do you get erections?
Asexual: "Erections are basically involuntarily physical reactions, so yes I still get erections"


tl;dr: Two young asexuals, one male from the Netherlands and another female from Australia age 20 meet online on a forum. They meetup in the real life as the young Dutch male travels to Australia. I believe the forum is AVEN and since it is AVEN the male's trip was probably bankrolled by his enabling parents. Btw according to that socially awkward doofus and his crappy definition every male is asexual. That is why AVEN doing advocacy or education doesn't work. I am sure most normal people who hear that uttered will only cringe and be confused. But since most AVENites have the type of self diagnosed low-level "autism" they cannot see how others perceive what they do.

Does anyone know the hilarious AVEN threads where they hail those success stories of that couple uniting and the alleged media success? In reality, any non-AVENite sees two socially awkward nerds with little options. But to AVENites it was probably discussed in 100 posts about "what a great success for PR and that they got together." That type of nonsense is all I see AVEN, what others would call desperate is being hyped up to no end. That is why AVEN cannot stand for education, research, outreach or activism. I didn't bring up the gamergate debacle for no reason, the AVEN community is just as socially warped. They also cannot see how others perceive what they are doing. I don't know but staring at pixels too long does something very negative to people mentally. I have had bronchitis since the 16th of March and haven't gone outside besides work in so long and I am just going nuts. But for most AVENites that seems to be the social norm.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby faeriefate » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:18 pm

Thrasymachus,

So you're saying that wanting evidence and proof makes you a neck beard? All anyone wants is for you to support your claim. I mean, I want you to support your claim. For one, I would LOVE proof on your claims of AVENites being "socially awkward" and needing "sexual rehabilitation". Unless, of course, you're seriously implying what I think you're implying. Because the people on AVEN are happy not having sex. I'm happy not having sex. Why? Because I'm not interested. I don't care. Honestly? I have better things to do with my life. If you have sex and enjoy it, that's fine by me, but keep me out of it. I'll let you be happy in your way, and I'll be happy in mine. Unless, you're seriously implying what I think you're implying? Because in that statement, you implying to sexually rehabilitate people that are perfectly happy with not having sex and don't want it. It's not hurting them, so why rehabilitate them? It's not hurting you, so why do you care? Why are you considering forcing people that just aren't that interested in sex to conform to your definition of normal?

And yes, I do have a serious issue with the fact that you're proposing sexual rehabilitation of people that are asexual. If someone's not interested, then they aren't interested, but please don't force them to conform to your standards.

Furthermore, you called AVENites "socially awkward". In which I say, huh? Your thought processes elude me, but perhaps that's because you aren't supporting your claims, just throwing around meaningless insults. AVEN is simply a place for those that just aren't that interested in sex to talk about how they experience their lives, and to get support from those that are interested in sex. If that makes them socially awkward, then I'd ask you to read a dictionary again. Many people on AVEN have their own lives and live them quite actively. I know I do. Society is not an issue for people on AVEN. Close-minded bigotry is. The same bigotry that leads to non sympathetic people to imply that there is something wrong with them because they are different. It's a safe place for people that want to just be accepted even though they don't accept sexual attraction.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 4:49 pm

Listen, I am not your social research nanny. Don't make demands of me. I made clear what is going on really at AVEN, it is really for lonely people who cannot socialize except online, and its stated purpose as a "Asexual Visibility and Education Network" is just a cover story that doesn't hold up when you actually participate for any length of time.

Most AVEN posts are in word game threads meant for their lonely userbase whether asexual or not(and there is a ridiculous amount of open sexuals who are also neckbeards who presume from their limited neckbeard experience to give their crappy advice like it is a gift) to distract themselves from their boring lives. All the people who defend AVEN who I have seen, cannot really seem to meet people in real life and seem to only be able to socialize in real life after investing alot of time online on surrogate socialization. In other words AVEN is part of the neckbeard empire, much like 4chan, most of Reddit, etc..

The simple fact is that by all accounts AVEN seems to be full of lonely nerds, most of whom do seem to experience sexual attraction who are trying to imitate the psuedo-scientific mental health community and create the equivalent of "brain chemical imbalance" theories for why they are sexually awkward and sexually alienated. But just like there is no objective test for any nonsense psychiatric disorders because they are made up for the financial gain of Pharmaceutical giants by people on the DSM panel who are getting paid by those giants since much of the panel is financially conflicted, so to it is for most self claimed asexuals(except they get no financial gain, they just do it because they are unrealistic and toxic). For example if I had pneumonia I could get a sputum culture done or other objective test and objectively prove if I had pneumonia. I don't really follow AVEN as closely as PIF(quite frankly how deeply he follows a forum he was banned from it seems years ago is creepy to me), but some of his posts do a good job of showing that asexuality is like a bus that many nerdy young people get on and off like just another fashion trend or meme that they might follow.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Pook » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:11 pm

Clearly everyone is mistaken here. Thraymachus is absolutely right and we should be following their lead to create the highest quality discussions possible. I move that we institute a 'Thraymachus law' and make it mandatory that you must insult someone once every sentence or be immediately banned. Truly this law would bring about a golden age of discourse.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby faeriefate » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:21 pm

AVENite coward. Classy. What? Every time someone confronts you on your obvious lack of evidence is now a coward now? Please, read a dictionary. It my be beneficial to your mental health considering the fact that you can't even formulate an insult that makes any marginal amount of sense. Especially when the first post I've makes it blatantly obvious that I made this account just to confront people on this thread that seem to not be able to follow a line of logic when it comes to criticisms of AVEN. Is AVEN perfect? Far from it. It's just by people volunteering their time to help it. People who willingly dedicate their time to AVEN in an attempt to make it better.

Demands? Whose making demands? I'm simply stating the fact that I want you to support your mindless claims to prove that you have actual knowledgeable sources to support them. Which I assume you don't. Because, you know, you've still failed to provide reliable sources. Including the one you just supplied. Wow! Way to go! Supply the source that's known for diagnosing everyone that uses it with cancer. Thumbs up!

It's quite interesting that you'd call a userbase that actively goes out of their way to schedule meet-ups to meet each other lonely and socially awkward, though. You know, because obviously socially awkward people that feared society as the vampire fears the sun would obviously avoid social interaction and meeting people at all costs. But sure, we're all lonely losers that hate people. We can go with that. I'll just pretend to protect your precious ego. Because obviously that's the issue here. You're lashing out at someone that gave a reasonable and educated response to your post because they proved you wrong, and I'm not even talking about myself here.

Though the irony is not lost on me. Aren't you, Thrasymachus, not a member of AVEN? Do you not have your own profile on said "neckbeard empire" full of "lonely nerds"? How terribly ironic. Which can only lead be to wonder, is there another reason why you're upset at AVEN? That's just an assumption, though. Based on the fact that you're bashing a website that you've had an account on for two years.

And you bring further irony into this through your change in topic. How you're using your lack of scientific knowledge to accuse mental disorders of being a pseudo-science despite the large amounts of research and many professional research papers written on topics that prove many mental disorders do exist through brain scans. Then acting as if psychology isn't a real science because it isn't based on scientific fact. Good for you! You've just given not one, but two examples of irony in one post! I'm most impressed!

I also quite like the part where you through PiF, someone whose on your side in this matter and agrees that AVEN is awful, right under the bus! Simply because you think that they're creepy because they are following something that they are actively protesting against! Though, comparing the two methods, I think PiF has a better idea on the matter than you do. After all, if you want to protest against something, it's best you know more about it so you can dispute it rather than close your eyes and ears and spout blind ignorance.

Let me get this straight here. My issue is not your feelings towards AVEN. You hate AVEN? Go right ahead! I don't care about that matter! My main issue is your lack of knowledge on the matter as-well-as the fact that your main argument seems to be insults both at individuals and the community as a whole. Because that's how you convince people that you know what you're talking about. Completely avoid the topic at hand and throw around blatant insults!

And yes, this post is absolutely dripping with sarcasm. At least it's more informed than blatant insults and more of a direct reply to the person I'm talking to rather than outright insulting someone that's simply trying to get you to do a bit of research before you form an opinion.

Lastly, to rub some extra salt into the wound, the fact that you and PiF both come on an asexual site to complain about asexuality is not lost on me.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Thu Mar 31, 2016 6:03 pm

Image

So this happened :lol: I found my inner neckbeard. Thank you lord Thrasymachus for showing me how a True Asexual must Live!

This is staying for 24 hours. No budging.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Pook » Thu Mar 31, 2016 6:47 pm

Thrasymachus is AVEN's Trump

He will build a wall to keep the neckbeards out and make AVEN great again.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:08 pm

The more I deal with proud AVENites, the more I realize I am dealing with the same type of unrealistic neckbeards that I battle on Reddit. Such unrealistic clowns don't need to interact with more of their kind, lest they turn asexuality into even more of the asexual version of the gamergate movement.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby ♥ Steph ♥ » Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:15 pm

Thrasymachus wrote:The more I deal with proud AVENites, the more I realize I am dealing with the same type of unrealistic neckbeards that I battle on Reddit. Such unrealistic clowns don't need to interact with more of their kind, lest they turn asexuality into even more of the asexual version of the gamergate movement.


Sweetie. It's not just 'Proud AVENites'. You're going to find people such as us (Clowns) from all walks of life.

Now who will fund this wall you wish to build?

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Pook
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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Pook » Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:17 pm

The neckbeards will pay for it!

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby KAGU143 » Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:18 pm

Whoa . . .
Getting a little bit TOO hot and heavy around here. Where do I start?
I want to remind everybody that personal insults aren't tolerated at Apositive and that I will edit posts that cross the line.

Thrasymachus. Okay, you aren't happy with the way that AVEN is being run. You've made that pretty clear, but what demonstrable evidence do you have to support claims like this:

AVEN seems to be full of lonely nerds, most of whom do seem to experience sexual attraction who are trying to imitate the psuedo-scientific mental health community and create the equivalent of "brain chemical imbalance" theories for why they are sexually awkward and sexually alienated.


How do you know whether or not a person experiences sexual attraction without actually getting inside their head and experiencing what they experience?
How can you decide that AVEN's members are "neckbeards" (and couldn't you come up with a better term, that, you know, uses proper English?) and that they are socially awkward, sexually alienated,or whatever:

. . . edit . . . AVEN is a neckbeard forum, for neckbeards and by neckbeards that can only socialize with someone in real life after wasting a lot of time online with them. It is a popular social trope that neckbeards are sexually alienated and clueless, so it is no surprise that most would convince themselves that they are asexual or born that way. In reality if they stopped being socially awkward neckbeards they could probably be sexually rehabilitated.


To put it another way, Thrasymachus, for most of your assumptions about AVEN: Citation needed.
If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby Thrasymachus » Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:38 pm

Personally I am mad Google Glass didn't take off, so the geek world could be further removed from the social equation. I hope the next attempt at a Google Glass like technology will succeed. I think the world will be better the more mega-nerds who cannot be without a screen embedded in their eye 24/7 via retinal projection selectively remove themselves from social space-time.

@ ♥ Steph ♥ :
Why would I need to build a wall? Do the gamergate nerds of asexuality even like to go outside? I think most of you spend way too much time instead staring at screens. So why would I waste time building a wall? You are not even good at joking.,,,

@ KAGU143 :
Most of the posts on AVEN like I said are in stupid word game threads. What proof do you want? That is how the uber-geeks of AVEN rack up 10,000+ posts, they just look at their life as something to spend and waste with nonsense like posting just to post. I am sorry but if you don't think AVEN is a neckbeard forum, you are not realistic or familiar with the word.

Personally I am just battling back at AVEN. It reminds of Reddit/4chan where nerds/geeks invert mainstream values and replace them with even more despicable values of their own. All I got from AVEN was alot of heckling from cowardly neckbeards and people with gender dysphoria. In other words people who are outcasts in real life, acting big online since they gathered a toxic plethora of their kind in one online space.

I gave citations from AVEN threads/a media appearance likely organized via AVEN. You have to be blind if you think the social mainstream will look at AVEN as anything other than a source of cringes or a joke. All I see on AVEN is threads that make me cringe/facepalm. Look at this thread where club daft pretend like a blatantly hyper-sexual song is some kind of asexual song:
http://www.asexuality.org/en/topic/1358 ... n-trainor/

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Re: Remind me Never EVER look at AVEN again!

Postby KAGU143 » Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:41 pm

Thrasymachus wrote:
Personally I am just battling back at AVEN.


I think the term for that is "trolling."
If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.